Who is still building DIY batteries

[ArthurEld]

It is amusing that DIY batteries are being discouraged now. I think the danger makes it less worthwhile to DIY now that the price is coming down for prebuilt safe batteries.
But I feel like I have a secret skill that I will continue to play with. I try real hard not to make mistakes because they are likely to cause a fire. I do all of my experiments in a shed that is 6 feet from my house so there is very little danger of setting my house on fire.

It still costs much more for pre built. Especially if you want something that is confirmed safe and dependable for the full life expectancy.

 

[JJJJ]

There are battery sales companies who have stepped up their game and are providing attractive cases one can place their batteries into. Shenzhen Luyuan apparently is developing a stackable case. Amy Wan can provide more details for those who are interested. I don't have a link at this time but it did come up on conversation about another product. They also have another case I provided a link to earlier. I am strongly considering picking up one of these myself for another build I am planning.

The DIY approach allows one to understand the inner workings of the process. Because of time, etc many will go for the prebuilt option. Admittedly there are advantages to creating a quick build. My guess is that installers will gravitate to these products due to time considerations. Their pricing will simply reflect the cost differences.

In my opinion, having the ability to field strip and repair a battery is an invaluable skill. I have developed basic skills with tools such as a multimeter, crimper and torque wrench. With these basic skills I can both build a system from scratch or assemble a prebuilt battery pack.

 

[Steve_S]

DIY Batteries are a great thing to be able to do and for many this is an acceptable solution nd can be a good financial saver as well. Sadly the Flipside to that coin is the Big Nasty Evil Insurance companies ! Who hasn't has at least some bad experiences with Insurance companies ? Their stipulations & requirements are NOT DIY Friendly and that is further enflamed by media pushing "batteries are dangerous" stories (mostly related to personal devices from cell phones to e-bike blazzing away) because of "stupid".

A Word of Warning !
A fellow down the road from me, also had a Really Nice & Super well done system, his DIY Packs were totally Top Notch ! This fellow is a Class A Electrical Engineer so he knows his stuff. Everything was checked & inspected - all a perfect pass. Well they got a Lightning hit, caused a fire (Nothing to do with Solr or Electric, it was structural - the porch took the hit and caught.) BUT When Insurance Co Inspector saw Solar Panels & System (not grid connected) he terminated insurance coverage. Did nt matter it was inspected and previously OK'd by Insurance co.

NEVER EVER ASSUME ANYTHING WITH AN INSURANCE CO !

 

[upnorthandpersonal]

BUT When Insurance Co Inspector saw Solar Panels & System (not grid connected) he terminated insurance coverage. Did nt matter it was inspected and previously OK'd by Insurance co.

That would be illegal here.

 

[Steve_S]

That would be illegal here.

One would think that is the case everywhere, being illegal to do for an Insurance Co... But the real world + Insurance & Laws is quite grey. Also his year, it seems that MANY Insurance Companies adopted a level of stoopid never seen before. I had to go through 5 companies to get "proper coverage" yet they will not cover the Powerhouse (separate structure 50'/15m from house) because of my battery packs. Still inspected & OK'd does not matter.

 

[timselectric]

Insurance would be useless, if they can deny every claim, for any made up reason.

 

[Steve_S]

Insurance would be useless, if they can deny every claim, for any made up reason.

TBH not a whole heck of a lot surprises me anymore, especially with things like insurance. I get that they have more claims & issues to deal with and even backing out of some markets altogether because their untenable but they are playing games with clients. Mind you, the laws etc are different everywhere so what they can get away with in one place may not wash somewhere else. I think that very soon there will be a reckoning & correction with regards to Insurance Companies.

 

[timselectric]

I didn't add my system to the policy. Because it would raise the rates too much to be worth it.
But as long as a claim is not deemed intentional on my part. Everything that is on the policy is covered.

 

[TheHappyNomads]

I didn't add my system to the policy. Because it would raise the rates too much to be worth it.
But as long as a claim is not deemed intentional on my part. Everything that is on the policy is covered.

Where are you located Tim? I ask because insurance coverage has been a big question I have had. Either to through the permitting process in my local jurisdiction so that insurance doesn't have any issue with it or just installing the system without permit/specifically requesting for it to be added to my homeowners policy.

 

[timselectric]

Where are you located Tim? I ask because insurance coverage has been a big question I have had. Either to through the permitting process in my local jurisdiction so that insurance doesn't have any issue with it or just installing the system without permit/specifically requesting for it to be added to my homeowners policy.

Kentucky

 

[Alkaline]

Insurance just needs a reason, I don't think this should discourage people from going DIY. Even for the cheapest prebuilt battery options DIY is still on average 25-30% cheaper. And less than half of some of the more pricey brands while still having the same quality.


Also after seeing people get yanked around regarding warranties form Battleborn, Eg4 and Relion (grand rv forums) I'm not so sure its worth the hassle.

 

[houseofancients]

That would be illegal here.

Same here

 

[TimE]

One would think that is the case everywhere, being illegal to do for an Insurance Co... But the real world + Insurance & Laws is quite grey. Also his year, it seems that MANY Insurance Companies adopted a level of stoopid never seen before. I had to go through 5 companies to get "proper coverage" yet they will not cover the Powerhouse (separate structure 50'/15m from house) because of my battery packs. Still inspected & OK'd does not matter.

The insurance system is well regulated in the UK. This kind of practise would not be legal in the UK. Its one of the reasons why Lomdon insures the world's shipping.

 

[Spunky]

I bought 16 brand new EVE 280s 2 weeks ago from U.S. warehouse stock, drove to Houston and picked them up, $115/cell w/copper busbars and nuts incl. And of the 3 tested so far they each have tested over 280AH from 3.45v. Valid QR codes. Grade A. Apexium 48v 280 DIY case kit (basically the Mason kit) for 600, 205 for the ebc a40L Charger/tester, and $54 for the cable that goes from case to Inverter. That was $2,700 total.

As a comparison, I had a quote from Seplos direct (from China) of Mason 48 DIY 200A BMS 3.0, LCD, BT, $475, 2M 50mm2 battery cable $60, (16) 'Grade A new 280AH cells' $99/e ($1584), RS485 Adapter $10. but add the month? wait and $456 for shipping! = $2585.00. That's w/o the EBC A40L tester. And of course, as always we would be at their mercy to actually provide new cells as promised.

I ordered a Basen-Green through Alibaba that is suppose to be State-side for $597 including shipping. This was four days ago and hopefully I will at least see a shipping notification soon. They said the BMS was their own, but after looking at the front panel, I'm guessing that It could be a PACE (6 LED status indicators).
Gobel will sell their boxes without cells, if you order 10 and that'd be shipped from China. Works out to be $620 each including shipping and this is the version without a balancer. Some say these also have a PACE BMS, but you don't know what you have until it's in your hands.

I like the package and form of the boxes as compared to building them on a shelf, just would like the prices of a steel box to come down.

 

[nc73]

Pre-made will never be cheaper or equal in pricing to diy. I saved 50%. Been flawless and at least I know what I built.

 

[tialiden]

Ordered! Eel V3 white box with the NEEy active balancer and 200A sepolos BMS V3 200A + Bluetooth.

$789.00 was my total, yes its high, but I already have 16s grade A Rept 280s and they aren't getting any younger!

Total spent so far was $2490 for the Rept cells form SFK

14.3 KW battery for around $3,300.00 only thing I don't have is a breaker for the 200 Amp... may need to mod the EEL case lets see!

Can you scan the barcodes on those REPT cells and let us know date of mfg?

 

[Alkaline]

Can you scan the barcodes on those REPT cells and let us know date of mfg?

The label said November 2022, but Gobel scanner said October 2022
08I-CB-40002-664AC-AG170-1425

I bought them in June so its been a few months.

08I-CB-40002-664AC-AG170-1425

I think the EVE 280K V3 would be the better buy now, but for me I was done buying anything made by EVE after what they did with the V2 280K and never acknowledged the problem with those.

 

[niktak11]

The label said November 2022, but Gobel scanner said October 2022
08I-CB-40002-664AC-AG170-1425

I bought them in June so its been a few months.

08I-CB-40002-664AC-AG170-1425

I think the EVE 280K V3 would be the better buy now, but for me I was done buying anything made by EVE after what they did with the V2 280K and never acknowledged the problem with those.

What's the problem with the LF280K?

 

[timselectric]

What's the problem with the LF280K?

Nothing wrong with the 80 I have.

 

[niktak11]

Nothing wrong with the 80 I have.

Nothing wrong with the 67 I have either. They tested at ~288Ah.

 

[Alkaline]

Plenty of people had well under 280AH for 280K made in 2022, I'll post from my previous thread:

My Results 278.4 & 901.4 WH, Luyuan Test Report said I should be getting 289.4 AH on these Matched & Batched Cells Genuine grade A:
https://diysolarforum.com/threads/what-is-going-on-here-just-got-zke-40.49076/

shane_Uk with Luyuan Genuine matched & batch results 276 AH vs the 289 Ah on the sheet; did not show WH, but I suspect it would probably be around 900 or more:
https://diysolarforum.com/threads/opinions-welcome-for-newbie-lifepo4-battery.47310/

18650batterystore.com grade A results, a person named Dena M. Says 277.7 AH (did not show WH, but again I suspect it would be around 900ish maybe 901):
https://www.18650batterystore.com/products/eve-lf280k#looxReviews

Fogstar UK grade A EVE 280, Cajocars gets 280.5 AH & 907.5 WH EVE stated Capacity was supposed to be 293.9 AH…, but still first person with a 280K to actually break the 280 barrier…but just barely
https://diysolarforum.com/threads/just-bought-16-280ah-a-grade-from-fogstar.51027/page-3#post-662021

EastFalcon got 278AH with cells from 18650batterystore that were supposed to be 295AH according to the sheet:
https://diysolarforum.com/threads/m...fun-kits-sfk-v4-heated-kit.63360/#post-790757
&
https://www.sunfunkits.com/app/ViewBenchmarkDetails?id=gw40gtkcbdr8

So there was clearly an issue, EVE may have corrected it later on, and then over compensated with the V3 version with Octagon. But All of the above referenced tests are with Manufacturer Test Report form verified suppliers.

Not the end of the world, but clearly EVE never acknowledged this and just said meh, we just sweep under the rug.

That being said IT is still advisable NOT TO BUY EVE 280K V2 or V1 and only go with the V3 or the LF304. I understand some people won't like this but these are the facts and I was one of the guys who bought V2 280K at $193.00 shipped/cell so take that for what you will...

 

[Sam Cho TX]

This whole 280K is bad is such a dumb thing going on, Oh nooooo I got 7 AH less the cell is now considered trash.... Ridiculous! I have 280K V2 form Sun Fun Kits and they tested to 278 with a BMS. I thought it was perfectly fine I built that kit and the cells in are still perfectly balanced, and I take really don't even take care of it.

So the V3 might be a little better but what in the actual F if all it pivots on is a few more AH.

People are crazy over the AH I believe. More important is do your cells stay in balance and are matched under load.

 

[niktak11]

If there was a problem then it must have been fixed by late 2022. For $5 more I'd probably go with V3 though.

 

[Alkaline]

This whole 280K is bad is such a dumb thing going on, Oh nooooo I got 7 AH less the cell is now considered trash.... Ridiculous! I have 280K V2 form Sun Fun Kits and they tested to 278 with a BMS. I thought it was perfectly fine I built that kit and the cells in are still perfectly balanced, and I take really don't even take care of it.

So the V3 might be a little better but what in the actual F if all it pivots on is a few more AH.

People are crazy over the AH I believe. More important is do your cells stay in balance and are matched under load.

I agree with you, but at the same time the whole community values AH over everything else...so if that is the indicator of quality the 280K V1 and V2 were sub par, especially considering that the previous 280N always tested in the Mid 290s.

 

[EastFalcon]

If there was a problem then it must have been fixed by late 2022. For $5 more I'd probably go with V3 though.

My cells form 18650batterystore were made in October 2022, 278AH is what I got, according to the excel file provided by 18650batterystore they should have been 295AH.

18650batterystore they were with in spec and a 5% error of margin is common in the industry.

I'm fine with them they work fine but you see videos of the REPT cells and Grade B 280K V3 cells that are in the 295... It can be disheartening a bit.?