Sure, never said it was a sane solution. The European code as a whole is a heck of a lot more sane than the one in the States...
Last edited:
Future of DIY LiFePO4 looks bleak…
- Thread starter fafrd
- Start date
MrM1
I'm Here, But I'm Not All There
Between the US electric code and the AHJs for that and everything else, we've effectively killed the pioneering, adventurous, inventive spirit here in the US. I think in some places you're not even supposed to change a receptacle without a permit.
Let's make sure we pad every corner so no one gets hurt. McDs coffee cup with the label "contents may be hot"...need I say more.
If the future of DIY LIFEPO4 is bleak its because some wants it to be bleak.
Let's make sure we pad every corner so no one gets hurt. McDs coffee cup with the label "contents may be hot"...need I say more.
If the future of DIY LIFEPO4 is bleak its because some wants it to be bleak.
Hedges
I See Electromagnetic Fields!
- Joined
- Mar 28, 2020
- Messages
- 20,673
At least in San Jose, I can change an outlet, a fixture, and inverter, a solar panel without a permit.
Worked for a federal research lab. Although a "Qualified Electrical Worker", I was forbidden to flip a circuit breaker or change a fluorescent lamp.
Guess what my first professional job was? As a 17 year old fresh out of high school?
Oh, and you know what the #1 purpose of that lab, the one with so little faith in my competence/education/licensing, was?
Developing the next thermonuclear bomb. ?
Starbucks: "The cup of coffee you're about to enjoy contains chemicals known to the State of California to cause cancer."
? knowing California, one of the chemicals would be H2O
FilterGuy
Solar Engineering Consultant - EG4 and Consumers
For whatever it is worth.... Will's recent video indicates the OP's original post has a lot of merit. It seems the change is already starting!
I would argue that just because Will is seeing lower revenue doesn't mean people are buying fewer cells. It could mean that the DIY folks are using other sources or they have purchased from his sources without going through his affiliate links.
FilterGuy
Solar Engineering Consultant - EG4 and Consumers
You could be correct but my impression is that the suppliers are seeing a broad-based reduction in cell purchases..... not just through @Will Prowse links.
Comparison with a 'not the cheapest' DIY build:
diysolarforum.com
DIY LiFePO4 Cost Analysis - February 2022 Edition
Disclaimer: I mention vendors below and use them as an example and as reference. This should not be considered an endorsement of said vendors! In light of Will's recent video and some of the comments both there and on the forum, I thought it would be a good idea to do a full cost analysis of a...
diysolarforum.com
Yes, it's the actual distributors that tell me this.
It is quite possible that amy with docan power is taking over the market, volume wise. I have setup my affiliate account with them but have never sold any through their site.
Or it could be that more people are buying from Alibaba distributors.
Distributors have told me that I am usually #1 or #2 biggest affiliate, so when I see a massive drop, it usually means people are less interested. Case in point is ecpc. Great batteries but there are other batteries that are slightly cheaper, so their performance has gone down on my end.
But yes I use link performance and what the distributors tell me over the phone to draw these conclusions.
It is crazy how many people were buying cells through my links last year, versus late 2021-now. Massive difference.
FilterGuy
Solar Engineering Consultant - EG4 and Consumers
It was a good run while it lasted!!! ?
I think this really coincides with having a US warehouse selling cells at what, $147 a cell, delivered within a week within the States. In addition, the sales of those rack mount systems exploded. I don't know how much overlap there is between DIY packs and off the shelf, but I think most people buying off the shelf rack systems never intended to DIY their own pack.
We certainly can be an impatient consumer. A US based warehouse, even at a higher price, is worth it to many people.
What I like to see is a standard, where I can buy a server rack battery from any vendor and simply slide it into the rack. When one battery goes bad in say, 5 years, I would want to be able to get a replacement from any other company in case the one I originally used was too expensive or went bust.
What I do know is that I am not qualified to work on those details(aging, new chemistries, different voltages) and I doubt the companies themselves would be interested in getting together and creating standards.
What I do know is that I am not qualified to work on those details(aging, new chemistries, different voltages) and I doubt the companies themselves would be interested in getting together and creating standards.
I think you stated grade A cells were at $0.24/Wh currently, while grade B cells from China could be had for $0.17/Wh and OTS rackmoumt batteries such as EG4 could be had for $0.29.
So that’s only a ~21% premium to avoid the trouble, risk, and anxiety of DIY if getting the good stuff and only a ~71% premium if you want to add in the risk and delay of getting aftermarket cells of unknown origin and quality from China.
I got my (probably) grade 16 B 280Ah EVE cells through AliExpress a year ago (when there were no other options) for $1400 delivered, so under $0.10/Wh. But I had to screw around capacity testing and then getting the vendor to replace a defective cell and who knows what lifetime I’ll end up getting from this budget DIY battery.
Those who love to screw around building batteries will continue to do so but for the vast majority of DIYers who have other projects they’d rather spend their time on, the peak DIY LiFePO4 battery era is behind us…
(I saw the writing on the wall late last year when I was looking for an OTS battery for a family member who had no interest in DIY and discovered the EG4 batteries for $0.29/kWh)
You can get new 304Ah EVE cells for $158 per cell (that's $0.16/Wh) from a US warehouse, delivered.
Zwy
Solar Wizard
Amy quoted me $0.18 per watt 280Ah with shipping on last quote a month ago. The first order with her 6 months prior was cheaper. Much of the increase is shipping cost. 35 to 45 days shipping.
I can add a K9 to my Batrium Core for about $250. Under $2700 for me to add another 48V 280Ah battery. For manufactured at $0.29 per watt, that would be $3900.
Personally I avoid affiliate links like the plague, and I'm sure I'm not alone.
Also this is specifically a DIY battery/solar forum, so outside it, it wouldn't surprise me to learn that most regular consumers don't want to go through the DIY b/s.
Similar threads
