Terrible Signature Solar / EG4 18Kpv Experience - Returning and Replaced with Sol-Ark 15k

[Daddy Tanuki]

You realize that to them every day is a new day - if they have time during the day to answer your questions and emails then so be it -- but otherwise I honestly believe that at 0001 hours daily they literally wipe the email and phone slate clean and start each new day fresh...

Someone should do a poll asking - have you (a regular person - not someone with 100K followers) ever called SS or emailed SS and got a reply within 24hours? or at all??

I know that what I am about to say is going to not sound logical -- but you have to think of it from a money making point of view and not a customer service point of view ...

From a business perspective SS is smart ... selling brings in money -- customer service doesn't ... having an employee spend time doing customer service instead of selling actually loses them money -- 99% of the people that have bought something from SS is not going to be in the market for anything new any time soon anyway - so why would they waste time, labour and money trying to fix issues when that is not going to change their PROFIT bottom-line.

yep emailed them prior to the black friday sale about the chargeverter and shipping. Got one email back after the sale. they did not answer the question so asked it again and crickets...

 

[Daddy Tanuki]

Once it's going I'm sure other loads will work but haven't run it to the test yet. It's a 3 hp but still, there is a lot of surge starting it with the cyclone prop inside. I'm trying to figure out how to wire my smooth start on my Quincy compressor. It how ever is a 5hp belt driven QT5 2 stage 80 gal compressor. Before the update it tried to turn it over but the KPV would shut off. Now it turns it over but I turn off comp after 6 seconds or so, it don't seen to turn it quite fast enough yet but it don't shut KPV down either. Not sure if I'm getting equal voltage on both lines. I don't have the CT's hooked up any where and don't know if that would help or not. In any case it is an improvement with the surge update. May be a sunny day might help, don't know.
I just wanted to show the off grid result.

Not sure that you can, but if you can, you need to adjust your pressure relief on the compressor head to not close until the compressor has gotten above the RPM that the motors start circuit has disengaged. That heavy clicking noise you heard on your dust collector was the start circuit engaging or disengaging.

once you get above the rotational speed that disengages the start circuit you should be fine. its the resistance provided as you compress air from a dead start (with 80~100 PSI in the tank) that prevents the motor from attaining enough RPM so that the centrifugal switch disengages. if it does not disengage due to low RPM due to too heavy of a starting load, it will burn up the motor in short order

I had the same issue on my ingersol rand (5hp belt driven 80 gallon) that was set up for US spec and when I plugged it in here in japan, it would charge from empty tank to full with no issues, when it tried to restart at the 100 PSI mark the surge was too high, it would not rotate fast enough and would trip the breaker.
initially I thought it was line loss initially as the lines to the main house were small. I got them upgraded along with my main breaker and still had the same issue though it got better.
It burned up the motor and I replaced with three phase 208. Got the three phase run to my work shed and no problems since. that is when i deep dove a bit and found out about the starting circuit using the centrifugal weight system to engage and disengage the start circuit. totally RPM based and does not care one whit about power it either spins fast enough or it does not. some people call them split phase motor's or dual HP motors.. Name plate would read 5hp but that is just for starting purpose with the start circuit engaged, then it drop to like 3 HP after start.

just some observations on the issues i had. these days I moved that compressor up to my cabin and run it off of a genset as its too big for my system, plus I have car lift, welders and my dust collector that are all 3 phase.

 

[Farm Boy]

Not sure that you can, but if you can, you need to adjust your pressure relief on the compressor head to not close until the compressor has gotten above the RPM that the motors start circuit has disengaged. That heavy clicking noise you heard on your dust collector was the start circuit engaging or disengaging.

once you get above the rotational speed that disengages the start circuit you should be fine. its the resistance provided as you compress air from a dead start (with 80~100 PSI in the tank) that prevents the motor from attaining enough RPM so that the centrifugal switch disengages. if it does not disengage due to low RPM due to too heavy of a starting load, it will burn up the motor in short order

I had the same issue on my ingersol rand (5hp belt driven 80 gallon) that was set up for US spec and when I plugged it in here in japan, it would charge from empty tank to full with no issues, when it tried to restart at the 100 PSI mark the surge was too high, it would not rotate fast enough and would trip the breaker.
initially I thought it was line loss initially as the lines to the main house were small. I got them upgraded along with my main breaker and still had the same issue though it got better.
It burned up the motor and I replaced with three phase 208. Got the three phase run to my work shed and no problems since. that is when i deep dove a bit and found out about the starting circuit using the centrifugal weight system to engage and disengage the start circuit. totally RPM based and does not care one whit about power it either spins fast enough or it does not. some people call them split phase motor's or dual HP motors.. Name plate would read 5hp but that is just for starting purpose with the start circuit engaged, then it drop to like 3 HP after start.

just some observations on the issues i had. these days I moved that compressor up to my cabin and run it off of a genset as its too big for my system, plus I have car lift, welders and my dust collector that are all 3 phase.

My test with the air compressor was with a empty tank. They say the Quincy compressor has a lot of friction in the pump being a 2 stage but starts fine with AC grid. There is a motor starter on the dust collector, which is where the clicking sound comes from. Sounds the same when using grid.

 

[Daddy Tanuki]

My test with the air compressor was with a empty tank. They say the Quincy compressor has a lot of friction in the pump being a 2 stage but starts fine with AC grid. There is a motor starter on the dust collector, which is where the clicking sound comes from. Sounds the same when using grid.

can you take a photo of the motors faceplate and then one showing the external capacitors? my compressor is a two piston single stage, but if your quincy is empty and its doing that then you just do not have enough power. and the clicking I am referring to is the one it makes when it is almost up to RPM. it is the sound of the brushs disengaging from the armature in the start circuit.

 

[Farm Boy]

Not sure that you can, but if you can, you need to adjust your pressure relief on the compressor head to not close until the compressor has gotten above the RPM that the motors start circuit has disengaged. That heavy clicking noise you heard on your dust collector was the start circuit engaging or disengaging.

once you get above the rotational speed that disengages the start circuit you should be fine. its the resistance provided as you compress air from a dead start (with 80~100 PSI in the tank) that prevents the motor from attaining enough RPM so that the centrifugal switch disengages. if it does not disengage due to low RPM due to too heavy of a starting load, it will burn up the motor in short order

I had the same issue on my ingersol rand (5hp belt driven 80 gallon) that was set up for US spec and when I plugged it in here in japan, it would charge from empty tank to full with no issues, when it tried to restart at the 100 PSI mark the surge was too high, it would not rotate fast enough and would trip the breaker.
initially I thought it was line loss initially as the lines to the main house were small. I got them upgraded along with my main breaker and still had the same issue though it got better.
It burned up the motor and I replaced with three phase 208. Got the three phase run to my work shed and no problems since. that is when i deep dove a bit and found out about the starting circuit using the centrifugal weight system to engage and disengage the start circuit. totally RPM based and does not care one whit about power it either spins fast enough or it does not. some people call them split phase motor's or dual HP motors.. Name plate would read 5hp but that is just for starting purpose with the start circuit engaged, then it drop to like 3 HP after start.

just some observations on the issues i had. these days I moved that compressor up to my cabin and run it off of a genset as its too big for my system, plus I have car lift, welders and my dust collector that are all 3 phase.

I will look into the pressure relief, and see if that can be adjusted. thanks.

 

[Daddy Tanuki]

I will look into the pressure relief, and see if that can be adjusted. thanks.

if you are starting form empty 0 PSI then it is not the issue. when a compressor auto starts it is because the pressure switched has closed normally on a two stage this is about 135 PSI and up. to help the motor start against that pressure the compressor has an unloader valve which empties the compressor cylinders and the metal lines that go from the compressor to the tank. be reliving pressure its easier for the motor to come up to speed as it gives it that short time frame with no built up pressure in the lines. if that is adjustable to allow it to stay open a little longer that would help. but your issue happens from an empty 0 PSI tank so it will not help any. my apologies.

 

[Dave911]

From a business perspective SS is smart ... selling brings in money -- customer service doesn't

No, that's not smart at all.
Many distributors live and die based on customer service/support.

If you buy something knowing there will not be any customer service for technical issues, then there will be no disappointment when there is nothing there. Amazon pretty much works like that. The thing that saves Amazon is that they have an easy return policy, for the most part. You buy it, it doesn't work, the manual sucks, its defective, you return it. Drop it off at UPS with free return shipping.

But when you are TOLD that they have GREAT customer service and technical support, but they won't call you back or answer simple questions.
Then that is a breach of trust. They they have deceived you. You feel betrayed.
They promised something, but did not deliver. You want to post stuff like that online so others are not "betrayed".

 

[SignatureSolarJess]

Perhaps James or someone from SS/EG4 can clarify how this all works with this inverter.

From my research on this, this was a unique situation where the inverter's software didn't accept the password for the user's settings. To fix it, we had to do a remote firmware update and adjust some settings since the customer couldn't access certain advanced ones. There are some settings that End User accounts cannot adjust because they can damage the unit. This is not a common issue with these new machines.

I hope this helps!

 

[ghostwriter66]

No, that's not smart at all.
Many distributors live and die based on customer service/support.

If you buy something knowing there will not be any customer service for technical issues, then there will be no disappointment when there is nothing there. Amazon pretty much works like that. The thing that saves Amazon is that they have an easy return policy, for the most part. You buy it, it doesn't work, the manual sucks, its defective, you return it. Drop it off at UPS with free return shipping.

But when you are TOLD that they have GREAT customer service and technical support, but they won't call you back or answer simple questions.
Then that is a breach of trust. They they have deceived you. You feel betrayed.
They promised something, but did not deliver. You want to post stuff like that online so others are not "betrayed".

The difference here between Amazon and SS is that i probably shop at Amazon 30 times a week for stuff ... so Amazon has a vested interest in keeping me happy so i keep coming back for more ... on the other hand with Signature Solar they don't have to care ... they already have your money ... youre not buying 30 things a week from them ... regardless if they sell you a $4000 item and it turns out to be great with NO issues or it turns out to be a total brick and they provide mediocre or NO customer service and make you pay for shipping both ways on returns, it makes no difference to them since its highly unlikely, that either GOOD or BAD experience, that you are going to be buying another high value item from them again anytime soon since most people only buy one expensive SCC/ Inverter ONCE ....

 

[Will Prowse]

2 - Renogy 550 Watt panels

and sorry if I confused things again @SignatureSolarJess this was a Amazon order.

no idea how/why... the tracking says they were picked up on Dec 11 after ordering on November 27th.
This is my third order of these same panels and it would have completed my collection.
as is this being the depth of winter and my six Renogy 550 panels producing about my needed average requirements, I think I'll just leave it at that for now and get my money back.'

Please make your own thread. This thread is about signature solar. Post your issues with amazon and associated vendor elsewhere. Cleaning this thread up now.

 

[Kenny_]

Please make your own thread. This thread is about signature solar. Post your issues with amazon and associated vendor elsewhere. Cleaning this thread up now.

Sorry I was just responding to the post prior to mine which was talking about Amazon, not Signature Solar.

 

[Dave911]

and they provide mediocre or NO customer service and make you pay for shipping both ways on returns, it makes no difference to them since its highly unlikely, that either GOOD or BAD experience, that you are going to be buying another high value item from them again anytime soon since most people only buy one expensive SCC/ Inverter ONCE ....

I disagree. In my experience few people buy a kit containing everything they need for a DIY solar project all in one swipe. They buy things incrementally and install it incrementally. I have grid power that is very reliable but I want to move to solar. So I have a list of what I want. Solar panels, breakers, chargers, inverters, panel support system, wire and cable, conduit, etc. I'm not in a rush to get this done. Its more important to me to do it right and not make some big mistakes. So I formulate a plan and layout and look for batteries, inverters, chargers, all of the parts, etc.
I'm definitely not doing this on a spur of the moment basis. If a new device comes out, I'm going to let someone else be the guinea pig. I read about suppliers, etc. For me this is a 6+ month process for phase 1. Phase 2 will depend upon the success of phase 1. Phase 3 is out there, as is Phase 4. This will likely go on for 2+ years until I consider it "done". My system will have 2-3 inverters with 2-3 racks of ground mount panels.
Extra capacity and redundancy are part of the plan.

For a company; Bad reputations are really hard to shake off.

 

[MainerUSNR]

but how long does this get to be the default reason?
How many product lines of inverters? I don’t want to badmouth signature solar, they seem to have some great deals
But it also appears that almost every inverter they’ve released has significant issue, typically software it would appear, which indicates that there is not enough time spent lab testing. How many of these issues would have never happened if more scenarios were realized in real time, more staff was properly educated, exposed, and familiarized with the equipment etc.
the notion that Gilbert is the super guru for a 6,000 dollar piece of equipment is ludicrous (no offense Gilbert he seems to genuinely want to help in any way he can) but you said yourself, signature is Huge in the DIY crowd. Which leads me back to…out of all potential resources of 2 separate companies it’s…..forum member Gilbert who saves everyone’s woes?
I hate everything that the solark business model stands for and yet here I am, still researching how to do my off grid home energy and thinking “wow, maybe this wattshappening guy has a point”

In what other industry is it deemed acceptable to spend close to 10k and have the expectation that you will be the beta tester

What other industry? Try the automotive industry, you spending tens of thousands of dollars on a vehicle and the brakes don't work right or the transmission doesn't shift. Look at the problems with the new Ford Broncos or Tesla electric vehicles. We are the beta testers! Oh yeah, there are the safety recalls and the wrongful death lawsuits too.

 

[Jpaction]

I am having similar issues. I have it setup to force discharge to start at 14:30 and it started today at 13:00. Yesterday it started at 13:30. This is pretty basic code that doesn’t work. I tried this with the peak shaving settings and had similar results.

 

[nuke]

I am having similar issues. I have it setup to force discharge to start at 14:30 and it started today at 13:00. Yesterday it started at 13:30. This is pretty basic code that doesn’t work. I tried this with the peak shaving settings and had similar results.

TBH after trying to write my own charge algo logic for the 18kpv (don't ask), it's far more complicated under the covers than you think. Lots of stuff possibly going on. I know it feels like it should be simple but OTOH you gets lots of knobs to turn

 

[Jpaction]

I think I have it figured out. I have AC Charge enabled and it looks like the discharge from the battery is happening within 6 minutes of the AC Charge window. So instead of trying to Force Discharge I am just setting the AC Charge window to end a few minutes before I want the discharge to start.

 

[xtrorion]

How big is your array?

Sorry for the late respone.....I have a 3 strings total production peeks at about 10k in the summer

 

[xtrorion]

OK, I am going to answer my own question. After rereading a few things. (I read all of this thread, which is crazy long, weeks ago.)

Somewhere along the way the OP needed to have some settings changed on his inverter in order to make it work properly. It was not possible since the setting/s was locked out to the OP. So someone from Signature Solar/EG4 had to go online and access his inverter "remotely" to make the changes.

I find this rather odd, and honestly a pretty big turn off. As I don't recall there being anything really odd about this installation.

Perhaps James or someone from SS/EG4 can clarify how this all works with this inverter.

This is correct!!! and truly the only issue I still have with them...I do get it, but there should be a way to accept responsibility and control my own settings...I worry about this down the road.

 

[Dave911]

I am having similar issues. I have it setup to force discharge to start at 14:30 and it started today at 13:00. Yesterday it started at 13:30. This is pretty basic code that doesn’t work. I tried this with the peak shaving settings and had similar results.

Did you get this resolved?